Posts by Half banana

22

The governing body are digging their own grave.

by atomant in

surely the gb aren't naive enough to believe their own lies.what does it take for the majority of j dubs to wake up to themselves and finally realize that they are being robbed on all levels emotionally.financially,spiritually,intellectually and many other aspects of their day to day lives..

Half banana

I suggest that the norm in governing any organisation requires the leadership to fulfil the job awarded them; that is the job of directing the people and the money and to make the business grow.

Historically there has always been a separation of the private beliefs and the public sentiments of leaders. People with responsibility are either trained in leadership or as in the case of the GB they are chosen for their fidelity to the org but whichever way a person arrives at the top of the tree, it is required of them to play a leadership role. The political forces for leadership demand a steely and often un Christ-like ruthlessness.

But also there are perks of the job... how about good old Pope Leo 10?

“At a lavish Good Friday banquet in the Vatican in 1514, and in the company of "seven intimates" Leo made an amazing announcement that the Church has since tried hard to invalidate. Raising a chalice of wine into the air, Pope Leo toasted: "How well we know what a profitable superstition this fable of Christ has been for us and our predecessors."”

As a JW I would never have thought this attitude was possible in Watchtower land but now having seen the dishonesty and lies of the organisation, I believe that it is possible to be in the GB and not be a true believer. Humans are very capable of duplicity and any doubting GB member has every incentive to continue the charade expected of him.

After all, this is now the pattern found in the congregations; many attending are just going through the motions but are no longer “true believers”.

The JW religion is fast becoming a hollow organisation.

14

I have to get this off my chest...cult equals guilible

by Sour Grapes in

two weeks ago while visiting a friend in north carolina, i agreed to go with him to the sunday public talk.

the public talk was about how the witnesses have the direction of angels while going in service.

the speaker told some real doozies and you could hear the "oohs and ahhs" from the audience.

Half banana

Yes SG, JW talk is rooted in angel fantasy, it's garbage for the gullible.

12

The New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures argues for more than one GOD

by smiddy in

gen.1:26 "and god went on to say "let us make man in our image according to our likeness.....etc,etc,.. the key words here are "us" and " our" ,he is including other life forms just like him in using plurals.. he did not say " i" will make man in "my" image ,using the singular vernacular.

the same is also noted in gen 3:22 "and jehovah god went on to say " here the man has become like one of " us".

again he is using the plural and not the singlar language clearly showing their were other life forms on an equal footing to him.. also satan via the serpent also knew the difference between good and bad before he tempted eve , showing he was on a par with jehovah god in knowing that fact along with the other gods in heaven.. another scripture that comes to mind is 1 cor.8:5 "........just as their are many gods and many lords,,,".

Half banana

It comes as a shock to learn that during the latter part of the Jewish Bible writing time period, the acknowledgement was that the partisan god of Israel YHVH, was not monotheist at all but henotheist i.e. the one to be worshipped exclusively among the many gods. It was only too apparent there were "many gods and many lords"!

In Genesis however the perception of god was clearly polytheist. Even when henothism replaced it, the god of Israel YHVH, simultaneously took on the duties later attributed to Satan ...(Amos 3;6) which is what would have been expected from any god of the Canaanites or other contemporaries. The whimsical god who both destroyed your crop and killed your enemies... gods were like that in those days!

My own researches show as Doug Mason tells, that Yahweh's consort was Ashera who was also his father's consort. Ashera appears to have been misunderstood by the KJ version of the Bible which omitted her name by referring instead to the high places where her images were revered. She fulfilled the role of the Queen of Heaven in the Canaanite pantheon as a fertility goddess. The sanitized Christian story of Jewish monotheism is a whitewash. We even have the names of some of Yahweh's brothers in the Bible; Chemosh for example.

YHVH or Jehovah, as the stone reliefs found in Palestine show; was an ox-headed idol, presented in the Egyptian manner seated and with long crescent shaped horns, these usually refer to a Moon God.

How did this wooden idol YHVH made by superstitious goat herders, get to become the almighty creator? It makes you think!

13

My strongest reason not to take anything especially in the new testament serious is found in JW grey bible

by Consciousguy in

guys i need a rebuttal in this.

cos this is what i plan to tell the elders when they come to me which i find inevitable.

due to general concession and confirmation from jw bible on page 1736. all the available christian greek scriptures manuscript today doesn't contain yhwh.

Half banana

Sorry Splash, I should have said the WT emphasis on numbers of manuscripts is misleading.

Agreed Sir82 and Consciousguy, if Big J allowed corruption of the text and that is what the WT org has been working from...everyone including JWs are all at sea. By this JW reasoning, there is no absolute divine edict.

Perhaps the GB want this bit of slack to claim it to be their job to determine what truth is? The Watchtower "truth" nowadays is that the Bible is all about the JW governing body.

13

My strongest reason not to take anything especially in the new testament serious is found in JW grey bible

by Consciousguy in

guys i need a rebuttal in this.

cos this is what i plan to tell the elders when they come to me which i find inevitable.

due to general concession and confirmation from jw bible on page 1736. all the available christian greek scriptures manuscript today doesn't contain yhwh.

Half banana

It is imagined that miraculously Jesus and the Bible arrived in the first century.

Jesus, the wonder working, virgin-born, saviour son of God with twelve disciples... under different guises had already existed as a literary trope for a thousand years or so.

The early Christians had no Bible. The texts which were collected to form the 'approved' versions of christian teaching was not made until the fourth century and continued to be modified for centuries after.

Sorry Splash but your emphasis on the number of manuscripts is very misleading.

The proliferation of Bible texts began about the ninth century. There are only a handful of manuscripts in existence from each of the second to the eighth centuries. The Ryland fragment, which I saw recently, is a sorry scrap of paper and gives little evidence of the supposed vigour of early Christianity.

The key to understanding Christianity is the recognition that there were many messianic cults vying for supremacy and patronage in the early years of the common calendar. There were many christian manuscripts circulating among the cults at their temples but never mentioning Jesus nor for that matter Jehovah.The label Jesus was a late inclusion to appeal to messianic minded Jewish punters who had a precedent for using this name. The Jews by custom as already discussed, were never to voice the 'sacred' name of God.

There was no original Bible. Manuscripts i.e. handwritten documents are notoriously susceptible to alteration by copying, forging and editing. It was only through the agency of the Roman Catholic Church that certain texts in circulation were authorised, forming what we now know as the Bible... and an orthodox interpretation was established at the demand of Constantine, hence the word Catholic meaning universal.

From these two factors of the fourth century; the book and the doctrine, all further Christian sects have arisen including the Adventist and subsequently the Russellites, Bible Students, and JWs.

154

I believe in Evolution and that God created life

by Crabby in

anyone else also hold this view or understand it at least, or do you feel the need to argue that both can in no way coexist?.

Half banana

Half banana, as you might have noticed, the chain of evidence, involving the laws of information and DNA, disproves the "scientific theorum" of evolution. An advanced information system, e.g., DNA, cannot spontaneously generate and improve on itself all the time. Impossible. What you are is in your DNA? Spontaneous mutations in your DNA are likely to kill you rather than improve you. So has evolution stood the test of time? Not really.

Vidqun, this is an assemblage of non-sequiturs based on the idea that everyone else understands the laws of your private 'information' religion.

154

I believe in Evolution and that God created life

by Crabby in

anyone else also hold this view or understand it at least, or do you feel the need to argue that both can in no way coexist?.

Half banana

Look folks, the days of belief and faith are over.

We now have a solid method of determining realities... even if we don't have all the answers yet. It is the painstaking collecting of a chain of evidence within the framework of a scientific 'theorum'. (I prefer the lack of ambiguity with the word theorum). This rationale of science gives a coherent idea formed from the evidence available which provides an explanation which can be transferred to other related areas. When it fails to do so where it would be expected, the theorem is questioned or the application of it is. If disproved; the theorem is modified to fit all known facts. Evolution has stood the test of time and has never significantly failed in its predictability, it requires no miraculous intervention or divine origin in its support. So the theorum of evolution is a fact and is not in doubt. But the proposition is that God must have got the ball rolling.

So to say “I think God started it and left it to evolve” is by contrast to scientific evidence; meaningless within the present post mythic world, post Enlightenment thinking. There is no evidence for it.

It is like saying “I like warm clothing”... it has no consequence, no useful meaning to anyone else.

To say “God started it” is the betrayal of an existential insecurity within the religious psyche which demands that there must be a spirit controlling everything. It is the comfort sought from an idealised paternal force where the absence of which would make life feel insecure.

The assertion that “God must have done it” is a Stone Age superstition. Wake up people... most of us are living in a new age!

13

My strongest reason not to take anything especially in the new testament serious is found in JW grey bible

by Consciousguy in

guys i need a rebuttal in this.

cos this is what i plan to tell the elders when they come to me which i find inevitable.

due to general concession and confirmation from jw bible on page 1736. all the available christian greek scriptures manuscript today doesn't contain yhwh.

Half banana

This is a head banging exercise...saying absolutely anything which disagrees with the official Borg doctrine will make you an apostate and get you disfellowshipped. Do you mind being d/f'd?

If you would rather leave without the label and curse they offer; why not try the fade route?

If you must argue with them get a list of at least one hundred errors of the JWorg.

47

Hidden message in JW bunker video?

by Dunedain in

so, i was speaking with a relative recently, who is "in" the borg, but is completely aware of the terrible hypocrisy from the gb down.

he is not in the box, and its great to be able to have a realistic, and logical discussion about the current state of the org.. we started discussing, specifically, about that bunker video that was released in december.

how it is being played at all the conventions.

Half banana

I guess that if there is a hidden message to frighten the faithful, it is that something nasty is soon about to happen... so don't leave.

It is so liberating to realize there is no Great tribulation, no Armageddon, no God's organisation and no God's mouthpiece but it is so sad and mentally crippling for those convinced they do exist.

18

So This is What They are Studying This Week at the Mid-Week Meeting -"Don't Give Way to Doubt"

by xjwsrock in

this week they finish up a chapter in the "imitate their faith" book about peter.

they cover the account of jesus walking on water.

in the story peter also walks on the water out to jesus.

Half banana

There is so much wrong with this Watchtower propaganda!

Walking on water is supernatural, who wants to live a life of miracles and perform miracles for the sake of faith? It would be mentally destabilising. The story of Peter’s example is perverse and should be ignored for the spiritual nonsense it is. These are thoughts for targeting gullible people. Try walking with your feet firmly on the ground for a change.

What on earth is good about faith? Why bother with the inferior quality of faith when today especially; we can know things? Faith is for those without hope or knowledge.

Doubts are a defence against being controlled by others. Doubts prevent us from being gullible. Only by taking a sceptical stance will anyone arrive at a reasoned assessment of reality. Doubt, without cynicism, is an essential ingredient of all we do.

There is one human sin which all Jehovah’s Witnesses have committed: being naive... and while the GB elevate their own position they abuse their followers by coercing them to remain naive.